#84 – The End


All good things must come to an end. So it is with some sadness but much fond nostalgia that James Schramko and Timbo Reid host the 84th and last episode of Freedom Ocean. Tune in for some parting lessons, some flashbacks, and some final characteristic banter from the duo.

Thanks for listening!

In the episode:

00:47 – Melancholy and reflective
03:05 – Where it all began
05:29 – Then and now
10:16 – Six years’ worth of ground covered
16:08 – Lessons from the Ocean
17:41 – Simplicity is key
22:34 – Closing open loops
24:54 – Whatever happened to..?
27:51 – The growing competition
29:40 – Where it’s at and where it’s going
33:05 – Remember when..?
35:00 – “I have to take a pee.”




There’s not really passive income, because you’ve still got to do the hard work. [Click To Tweet]
Just take the notes you really feel compelled to take. [Click To Tweet]
What you say “No” to determines what you say “Yes” to. [Click To Tweet]
You don’t own things. They own you. [Click To Tweet]
As long as it’s an open loop, it’s sucking on your brain. [Click To Tweet]


Internet Marketing Products & Resources

Here you’ll find Tim and James have some things to help your business become more powerful.

Tim: Welcome back to the wonderfully warm, wonderfully calm waters of the Freedom Ocean. I am one of your hosts, Timbo Reid. Over there, on his longboard in his board shorts, is Jimmy James Schramko. Welcome, buddy.

James: Good day, mate, how are you?

Tim: James, I’m melancholy. You?

James: And why is that, Timbo? Yeah, I’m reflective.

Tim: We’re not our usual up-and-about selves. Why is that? Well, I’ll be getting straight to the point, mate. Because you’ve got waves to catch and I’ve got people to see. This is the last episode of Freedom Ocean.

James: This is Episode 84, the one that will be remembered as the last. And maybe, Timbo, you’ve reached your millionth question.

Tim: [Laughs] Well, no I haven’t. Maybe I have in this sphere of the Freedom Ocean. But as a podcaster, the minute I run out of questions I’m stuffed, because I think curiosity is one of my secret weapons.

James: Let’s talk about Freedom Ocean. Let’s be self-indulgent in this episode. You know, sometimes we get people saying, “Come on, talk about the topic.”

Tim: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

James: But they do like the banter. I think it’s worthy of it this time.

Tim: Aw, people complain, Jimmy. I get, with my other show, The Small Business Big Marketing Show, mate, I have, you know, “Stop doing ads!” “I don’t like your iTunes album cover artwork,” honestly, mate. You know, you can’t please everyone, Jimmy.

James: That’s true. And we’d never actually ran ads on Freedom Ocean because we always made it work for ourselves, until it didn’t work. And looking back at our back catalog, you know our first episode was published in February 2011. Can you believe we’ve been going for over six years with this show?

Tim: That sounds like we’re prolific podcasters, at least with Freedom Ocean. And that is just not true, because if we’ve been going for six years, we’ve only created 84 episodes. So it’s a relatively weak effort. But I think there’s quality in there.

James: Well, look, I think there’s a few factors. One is that it’s certainly not the only podcasting both of us have been doing. In that same time, I would have popped out probably a thousand podcasts. SuperFastBusiness is in the 500’s, and that’s with the ones that we’ve still deleted, some of the older ones. And then I’ve done a lot of guest podcasts, and then I’ve done a couple of other ones on a few other related podcasts.

Where it all started

But I want to say this, Tim: I wouldn’t have done any of those if I hadn’t have done Freedom Ocean, because it was when you came to me and said, “What do you think about doing a podcast?” That’s when you sent over a little document that taught the team how to set up a podcasting plugin, and it was the first time I submitted a podcast to iTunes. And even though I was able to retrospectively podcast my other blog where I’d been doing audio interviews, it was my foray into Apple, and I wouldn’t be the man I am today unless you had come into my life. So thank you so much.

Tim: Geez, mate, brings a tear to a glass eye. Thank you, they’re very kind words.

And you know, I remember tapping you on the shoulder all those years ago, because what had happened was you had appeared as a guest on The Small Business Big Marketing Show, and it was a very early episode. I’ve been doing that podcast for eight years and you were probably like in early in the second year. And I remember at the time, you had an affiliate program and I’d done no affiliate marketing. I didn’t know much about it. I had varying views on internet marketers, of which I put you in that category. And anyway, long story short, you made an offer to my listeners to (at the time it was our listeners, I was doing it with a fellow, Luke) and you made an offer to our listeners of you know, buy this training course. And I think it was 200 or 300 bucks and you gave us 50 percent commission on sales. And we did thousands and thousands of dollars in sales.

And I remember ringing you. I said to Luke, I said, “I got to ring this bloke.” I said, “Aye, I’ve got to thank him, because this is incredible.” It was the first dollar we’d made out of the show and it was the first affiliate marketing I’d ever done. And I rang you, I thanked you, and then I just said, “Listen…” I don’t know whether it was the same phone call or it was pretty close around the same time. I said, “Listen. Clearly you got a million bucks and clearly I’ve got a million questions. I think there’s a podcast in it.” And Freedom Ocean was born.

James: And you know, we did cover a lot of topics. I look back through the 80-odd episodes and some of the titles are just fantastic.

Tim: Yeah they are.

A realization

James: It makes me want to revisit some of them and update them in my own time, but with a different lens. And this is the important part – what I realized… Last week, actually, I ran my most recent live event, which I do pretty much every year. And this was I think the twelfth event, twelfth big event. And then I looked back from seven years ago and the survey results that I did, I usually pre-event and post-event survey my customers. Seven years ago, it was around about the time when I appeared on your show, 25 percent of my audience were yet to make their first $10,000 online. And the premise of Freedom Ocean was really to be educational and to help people ease into the topic of online marketing and to start applying it to either start from scratch, or to do some of this stuff for an existing business, but with the filter that it was pretty much all new.

These days, my audience, Tim, when I survey them, around about 10 percent of them have yet to make that $10,000 online. But some whopping number, over 70 percent of them, are making $100,000 or more. So what I realized is my audience has grown up. I think a lot of our original Freedom Ocean listeners have come along, got on the online thing and done something with it. Or not. And they’re either mature or out of it.

And I think that that’s the big realization I had. Hey, you know, Freedom Ocean is no longer the market where I focus my energy because I’ve grown up with my audience as well and I tend to be having very advanced conversations and high level conversations in my own communities. And you tend to be dealing with actual, real businesses with your Small Business Big Marketing crowd. And I think we’ve found our episodes slowed down a bit because I think we moved past our market.

Tim: Yeah, definitely. I think it was definitely that, and you had that realization after your live event only last week. I remember you calling me last week and I could hear it in your voice, you were kind of like the penny had dropped for you, where you’d gone, “Hang on, things have changed.”

And these are the people, maybe they’re the same people that you’re talking to, but you’re talking to them differently. You’re having different conversations, and it’s not the kind of conversations that this show was ever for. And they’re not really the kind of conversations that I want to have. Because you know, like I did, I was curious about online marketing, internet marketing, whatever you want to call it. I was curious about the people who did it. And I had a whole lot of questions around that and I just think, you know…

And the other thing for me too is that I’m going to take most of the heat. Not all of it, but most of the heat for… actually, I could almost take all of it for not creating more Freedom Ocean shows. Because you were the one that was bloody ringing me every second week and saying, “Come on, can we do it?”

James: You’re not Robinson Crusoe there. I’ve actually found this challenging with all of my podcasts except for my own podcast. It’s a thing, and it’s just that people are moving at different speeds and they have different things on their plate.

Tim: Well, here’s the thing. Like, let’s be honest about this. I think there’s a few things around that. You saw some really good financial results from Freedom Ocean. So therefore, why wouldn’t you want to do more of it? That wasn’t what it was all about. And I always have represented the listener in Freedom Ocean. And I always found that as a listener and as someone who is trying to create an online business and trying to create a lifestyle business and questioning, “God, is it really possible to make money hanging out on a hammock and you know, tapping three things on a MacBook a day and all that kind of stuff?”

I would always walk away and I think listeners were the same, you’d walk away for an episode of Freedom Ocean with like 10 things to do. Not doing nine of them, because life gets in the way, and then going geez, you know? And then I’ve got to go and create another episode of Freedom Ocean, and it’s like, well sh*t, I haven’t even done anything based on what we talked about last time. That has been one of the big learnings for me, Jimmy, is that you know what Freedom Ocean was all about, which is creating those lifestyle businesses, those online businesses. I dare say passive income. Well, I don’t think there’s anything as quite, there’s not really passive income, because you’ve still got to do the hard work.

A lot of ground covered

James: There’s work. We’ve never targeted the phrase “passive income,” but we certainly talked about leverage, how to leverage their time and doing the right things. But gosh, looking back at our back catalog, we certainly covered a lot of ground in just those few episodes, 80-something episodes.

Tim: Oh, a lot of ground.

James: It makes me want to go and listen to them and reminisce.

Tim: Do you think most of it’s still relevant?

James: I do. I think when I look back at my old courses and the information we talked about, it’s still super relevant. A lot of those posts should stay up and will still serve people in the future who are starting out or looking for some ideas.

I’m getting this idea that I would like to go and summarize my old posts. You know, listen back to them and just take a concise note and do some kind of a redux or a condensed abridged version of it. But the material’s solid and the mind maps I was using back when I did courses at that time, well, they’re still exactly current. I was predicting things that were going to happen in the future. And you know, even if you want to look at things like podcasting, we have been doing it, you’ve been doing it for eight years. I’ve probably been doing it for about six years by the look of it.

And you know, as we were talking about today even just before this call, we think podcasting is going to be way bigger in the future, so I’m certainly not saying podcasting is out. I’m saying it’s good to focus on your target market and to stay in your lane on the freeway. And for you and I, every time we pull up to do a Freedom Ocean episode, we’re sort of having to veer off, pull over to the side for a minute and recalibrate just for that episode.

But I think our audience has grown up with us. And you know, the interesting thing from my perspective is when we catch up for our bookings to record, we usually end up having a discussion about your business and my business and forget to hit the record button. Because the stuff we’re talking about is not as relevant for our Freedom Ocean core base, the people who are coming into it. So that has been an interesting thing. We’ve basically grown up. We’re like it was a little kid and now it’s an adult and it’s heading off during the day and doing its own thing.

Tim: Correct. Yeah, totally.

Got a favorite episode?

James’s favorite

James: I guess I enjoyed dropping the double your profit and halve your work hours type stuff. We did that more recently. That was kind of like a concise summary of everything up to that point. It’s like, of all the things I’ve learned, here’s how you fairly quickly get there. And that one was a mash-up of some ideas that I did for people.

People want me to talk about teams, and that’s not a start-up thing. But people who are more into it, they’re going to have a team of five or six people. And it was also combining some ideas about optimizing yourself. And I think that’s a huge hang-up most people struggle with – the mindset, the overload. Making good decisions and all of that. And then the third component was getting the right business model and it involved leverage and subscription business in particular.

So that was episode 78, 79 and 80, and it was sharing information that I had compiled to present at a conference. I turned it into a free course, it became the lead source for me for new business because I was attracting people who could immediately say, “Hey, this is actually good stuff.”

I guess in recent times that was good. But you know, when I look back, we had some really fun episodes. Like four or five years ago, we were talking about well, you know, is SEO still relevant?

Tim: Yeah.

James: You know, we said, “Yeah, absolutely it is.” Back in Episode 23, we talked about smart decision-making strategies and things. So I think we really covered everything from making a masterclass to being a super affiliate. And in that six years, my business and my life have changed so much. But Freedom Ocean was still that core drum where we got to have a platform and share what’s going on.


You know, I changed my business model significantly. Those courses you talked about, I don’t have any physical products anymore. I don’t even have an affiliate program anymore.

Tim: No, you don’t.

James: I don’t even have the SEO or website development businesses anymore. I’ve just streamlined down into a real core business and now I know who my customer is. Having that level of clarity has taken me a decade online to get to this point. So just to put that in perspective, I’ve been doing it pretty much every day for 10 years, so it’s no wonder that a listener could get potentially overwhelmed just injecting themselves with a few podcasts here and there, trying to step into it casually. You know, you could get run down by the traffic.

Tim: Literally. I remember it was either the first or the second podcast I ever listened to, which was Internet Business Mastery. Do you remember that?

James: Yup. Where they had stage names and then they came out later with their real names.

Tim: I didn’t know they did that. Why would they have done that?

James: I don’t know.

Tim: Then they split up. But I remember listening to that and I can still feel the excitement every time I listened to an episode. And I couldn’t listen to it at night, because I couldn’t sleep. Like once, I had to go for a drive and listen to it, just because it was just so exciting to think what was possible. This was about eight or nine years ago, and you know that feeling of like, ‘My God…’ and all of a sudden it becomes overwhelming. And you do, you get mown down by the traffic. In fact, I had a listener of my other podcast just tell me last week how he had to stop listening for a while because he just had a journal full of ideas. And I know that feeling.

Lessons from the show

And I guess there’s a number of learnings that I’ve taken away from Freedom Ocean. But one of them is like, you have to take action. You have to do stuff. And on top of that, you can’t do it all yourself, because you’d just go nuts. And it’s even like some of the advice that you were giving me in the last couple of weeks around my forum is valid advice, but there’s some technical stuff there that I just can’t do.

So therefore, if you are going to start an online business and you are going to create a bit of a lifestyle business, then you can’t do it all yourself, despite the fact that these days and even since we started podcasting, Jimmy, some of the tools available to people who want to start an online business is incredible, really. But there’s still a lot of technical stuff and I’ve always been one to sort of err away from that and be kind of focused on creating great content and let others do the rest.

That’s getting into a bit of detail there. But anyone listening who does go back through the back catalog and learns about webinars and learns about affiliate marketing or video marketing or whatever it is, you cannot do it yourself. And I think one of the things that always amazed me, even from the early days of meeting you, Jimmy, was the size of your offshore team. And you can’t look at you or any of these other guys who are doing some really big things and big numbers online and think they’re doing all themselves, because they’re not, like any business.

Keeping things simple

James: No one’s doing it themselves. I was actually thinking about that today. You know, we still have a team of eight. And I’ve only really got two products. Three if you count a side project we’re working on. But I will say, I’m using less tools and less hardware than I’ve ever used online except for when I started. Like right now, I just use one MacBook Air. I don’t even have an external monitor because it broke. And I’m using an iPhone to record my videos. So I’ve kept my infrastructure really simple.

These days, when I run an event, I actually put up a slide of two hikers. One has this huge overloaded backpack and he’s struggling and sweating. And another guy’s just got a little day pack. And I instruct the audience, please just take the notes you really feel compelled to take. Don’t transcribe the entire event. We’ll give you the entire event on video, audio and a transcription with a PDF, every single word for word. That’s all captured for you. To enjoy this, just take the least notes possible and put them as an action step.

I went through my two-day event and I came out of it with about 10 check points in my notes on my iPhone screen. That was it, because I knew that I could go and watch the video later or listen to the audio or check the PDF. I like to read, actually, just as a side note. I can scan an hour-long presentation in about three or four minutes just through scanning through the bullets. But to be economical with your notes is the key. And for the same reason, I don’t record my mastermind calls with the audio, because then I’m going to have all this stuff to listen to. So what I do is I open up a spreadsheet and I just write down the key points from every call. And what it turns out is for every hour of call, I usually have around about five or six lines in my spreadsheet of key points – the highlights, the bullets.

And these serve as somewhere I can go and look up, which is highly keyword-searchable. And it’s also going to be the support for a presentation or an idea for a book or whatever. I actually keep a log called Concepts. So whenever I come up with a concept, whether it’s Own The Racecourse or the chocolate wheel (and we’ve talked about these before on Freedom Ocean), I put them in my concepts register and then I can make some notes around that.

What I’m trying to do at the moment, I’ve actually pulled out all the tubs from the garage, all my folders, all my notebooks and everything. And I’m just tipping them into the minimum possible notes that I can and then I’m shredding them and putting them in the trash and getting rid of them. So I’m in this recycle mode where I’m just collating, curating, eliminating and purging.

You just have to go through that consumption phase to get to the other side where you know you’ve had enough. You can’t take any more and now you have to delete. So I’m at that stage now and that’s where Freedom Ocean’s at, it’s on my to-don’t list now. You know, I don’t have capacity or space for it because it doesn’t fit my model.

I want to just say this point: if you are going to go through the back catalog of Freedom Ocean and have a listen to the episodes, it’s so much more useful if you do it with the filter of applying what you learn to an existing business.

If you don’t have a business, go and become someone’s best buddy. Go and help your sister’s hairdressing salon or find someone who’s got an online website. It could be an accountant or a lawyer or a smash repairer, it doesn’t matter. And just use the things you’ll learn in the show on that business and you will learn how it works. And once you get it, you can apply it to anything. And then you’ll have your other problems – that’ll be the paradox of choice. Once you have this superpower, you could apply it to anything your heart desires. That’s the frightening thing. We’re like, ‘Oh my goodness, I could just have an idea and go into business tomorrow and possibly even be successful.’ That’s exciting, exhilarating and exhausting, all at the same time.

Tim: Yeah I agree with that, mate, it is. Boy, it’s freeing to throw stuff out. And I think that doesn’t just mean physical stuff, but we carry a lot in our heads, too. Just knowing that there was an episode of Freedom Ocean to create, you know, as an example, it’s like, oh boy, I’ve got to get back to Jimmy and we’ve got to lock it in and you know, I think it’s great. Sometimes hard decisions need to be made, and what’s that saying? What you say “No” to determines what you say “Yes” to?

Closing open loops

James: Also, you don’t own things. They own you. So as long as it’s an open loop, it’s sucking on your brain. That’s how the waiter remembers your order. Hopefully. What is it? The zeitgeber effect, where…

Tim: Never heard of it.

James: Well, it’s when they talk about teaching with open and closed loops. They open up a loop – you know, when the newsreader says, “And after the break, we’ll tell you about…”

Tim: That’s a hook.

James: Well, it’s also an open loop that you just can’t close, so you can’t switch away. And the guy who discovered this actually worked in a research lab, and then he was on a lunch break and he wondered why the waiter could remember the orders. But after the orders were delivered, he couldn’t remember what everyone ate because he’d closed the loop and let it go from his mind.

Tim: Yeah, right.

James: So what we’re doing here is closing down loops. So if you look for all the open loops in your life – what are you still open to? What do you still have obligations for? What remains waiting for you? Do you have a garage full of mess? Is there a pile of washing in the laundry? Is there a stack of bills on your desk? All these things are just taking energy from you because they’re currently open. Close them all, as many as you possibly can, and have the least options available to you, and you’ll be able to give it your energy.

Tim: That’s good advice, mate. You’re a little bit spiritual in your old age.

James: Ha, ha. Well, you know what? I hope you’ll come back and do some guest podcasts on SuperFastBusiness.

Tim: Is that your one and only podcast, going forward?

James: Yes. The plan is, SuperFastBusiness will be my focus, because I have control of the talent turning up.

Tim: Yeah.

James: Primarily. And I can curate guests in and out for multi-part series, that’s worked so well for that show. We have three or four or five episodes with the same person, or a series. Could even make seasons for that show. I’m thinking that’s possibly the way of the future. If you’ll look to clues from places like Netflix and HBO, you’d have to think serialized podcasts will be a big thing in the future.

Tim: It seems to be. Well, and even the bigger podcasts, they seem to have a start and an end. Even the guys at StartUp, they do the series. One I’m listening to at the moment, which just was like a six-part series, is Missing Richard Simmons, which has been kind of interesting. You know the Richard Simmons guy, he was like the 80s..? He’s gone missing.

James: Wow.

Tim: Yeah.

Whatever happened to..?

James: There’s ones like that in the surfing scene that I don’t expect listeners to know about. But they have documentaries where they go and track down this guy who was famous at Malibu in the 60s and they’re like, where is he? And they get whispers of where he is and they do a whole documentary of tracking him down.

Tim: When you say “documentary,” is that video, or audio?

James: It’s a video but it’s a great storyline. It’s like, whatever happened to..? It’s compelling.

Tim: The first one I ever saw on that model was the Winnebago man. Have you seen that?

James: No.

Tim: It’s great, mate, the doco. And you know Winnebago, how they were huge in the 50s and 60s? So they used to be all over the TV with these TV ads. And there was this guy who was the Winnebago man. He was the presenter in all these ads.

Well, what people didn’t see in the ads was that he had just a really real potty mouth and a real big temper. Right?

James: Right.

Tim: And the camera guy on set for all the ads with the Winnebago man kept the camera and sound rolling after the director called “Cut.” And the profanities that came out of this guy’s mouth and the abuse that he’d reel at the lighting guy or the teleprompter guy or anyone, anyone on set was just hilarious. So anyway, these tapes came to be like two decades later. So some guy took it upon himself to then go, “OK, I’m going to find the Winnebago man.” And he turns out to be living in a (spoiler alert by the way, spoiler alert) he turns out to be living in a cabin in the mountains. And they catch up with him, and he’s the nicest old bloke.

James: Aw, that’s lovely.

Tim: Yeah, yeah. Winnebago man – one of the things I love, and we’re turning into a podcasting discussion now, but one of the formats that I’m loving in podcasting you know, as we were talking about it before we hit record, Jimmy, is you know Jeff Bezos talks about Amazon being in day one. Amazon, like what is it, the fifth biggest company in the world? I think podcasting is like in its first hour on the kind of life cycle clock, because you know it’s got so much growth potential and one of the things I’m seeing, which is hard work but these storyline-based podcasts, whether it be a serial like This American Life or like Missing Richard Simmons, these guys are creating like 50, 60 hours of tape and crunching it down into 30-minute episodes. Massive amount of work. Massive costs. But you know, great listening. Great listening.

James: Yeah, I think it’s just going to be big. And I can say that since I don’t have the big launches and huge paid traffic streams, podcasting is the core engine of my business.

An increasingly competitive field

Tim: Well, it’s becoming incredibly competitive since I started it, both in the quantity of podcasts appearing, but I’m just seeing in my space just big names also appearing. You know, like I’m now sort of getting bumped off the ladder by Gary Vaynerchuk or Tony Robbins or you know, these big names who have finally realized that hey, podcasting is a serious marketing channel. I find it interesting that more smaller-sized businesses don’t embrace it, because it’s cheap and effective.

James: It is, but I think, like you said, it is going to get more competitive. You were an innovator and we were part of that early majority. It’s still in the early majority phase, but then they’ll, like most things, they’ll just pick up when it’s like the late majority and then they’ll be the laggards. You know, in 15 years, someone will think, ‘I wonder how I start a podcast?’ Like, they’ll be just coming around to it.

Tim: But my view on that is that that’s the creative challenge. So like anyone listening – and you could take the conversation beyond podcasting – I think whether you’re thinking of doing a YouTube channel, writing a book, starting a forum or whatever they’re thinking of doing, yeah. Many, many have gone before them, but the creative challenge is just to make it better than the other ones, right? It’s how you deliver your message, how you package it up.

James: That’s why markets tend to go pro. They go into serialize, they’ll have good sound quality expectations, you’ll have a marketing budget around it. We were talking about a guy who thinks it’s going to take 100 million dollars to set up a proper podcasting network because that’s what it’s going to take to be a Netflix of podcasting. So it just turns professional, that’s all.

Where it’s at and where it’s going

And I think it’s interesting to get into technology not too early, where you are the only person doing it and you might have market share but not for long. It’s like the AdWords rush. Like right now, Facebook is where it’s at. Where it’s going to be is Instagram and YouTube and so forth.

But I think podcasting is very strong. But video and podcasting, those two things. Because when I think about my own consumption habits, I’m using Instagram and streaming media on apps now instead of free-to-air TV. We don’t go down to the video shop and get a tape anymore, do we? It’s all about using these set-top boxes and on-demand video content. And audio content is great where you can’t watch a video, which is walking the dog, being in the gym. Driving is a classic example. I’m sure they’re the markets where I think we’re going to be moving into free-to-air radio space. And that’s actually true of my own consumption. When I go for a long drive up the coast, I will listen to a podcast, and I don’t even listen to podcasts very often, there’s just one or two that I might listen to which I’ll save up for a two or three-hour trip and I won’t listen to free-to-air radio.

Tim: Why don’t you listen to more podcasts?

James: I don’t feel like I want to be… Well, I haven’t found many that resonate.

Tim: You don’t have to learn, they can be entertaining. Like, I listen to Roy and HG, it’s just my go-to, it’s hilarious.

James: Well, I’m just in that phase where I’d rather be consuming surfing video content than listening to podcasts.

Tim: Are you listening to that 80s tape still? A bit of Gloria Estefan?

James: Not so much.

Tim: A bit of Bonnie Tyler?

James: You know, with phones these days, Telstra are more than happy to give you…

Tim: A bit of Bon Jovi? Jimmy, don’t change the subject.

James: …a one-year iTunes subscription, right? So you can pretty much get any sounds.

Tim: Jimmy, Jimmy, take a breath. Take a breath. Talk to me about Bon Jovi. Talk to me about that Bon Jovi wig you’ve got on the bed head.

A Guns N’ Roses concert

James: I don’t, but I did go and see Guns N’ Roses.

Tim: Did you?

James: And I didn’t even realize that they’d broken up for years and it was quite a special concert.

Tim: Where have you been? Was it any good? Does Axl have his voice?

James: He was a bit of a disappointment. But Slash, wow, he’s amazing. I’ll tell you what was epic was we had a little bit of AC/DC because as you know, Axl sings for AC/DC from time to time. So we got treated to Angus Young thrashing out some classic…

Tim: That’s pretty cool.

James: …early AC/DC song. For me, that was by far the highlight.

Tim: Yeah. Man. I didn’t know you went to Gunners. Slash’s biography is a great read. You just kind of have to ask yourself the question, “How are you alive?” given the amount of drugs that guy did. He tells the story of waking up on a golf course in Hawaii stark naked and running along the 18th green to the clubhouse and hiding in a cupboard naked.

James: And he was born into music.

Tim: Well, yeah. Sure was.

James: Parents were doing album covers and costumes for famous musicians.


That’s a thing, I never used to go to concerts. I didn’t use to surf. There’s been a lot of changes in my life since we started this show. And it’s been always good updating new installments and it’ll be like a time capsule of that transition from the first time we recorded a few episodes at once out on the acreage.

Tim: On the acreage. Yes, I used to sit on the floor. You had a very unusual office back there, in your home on the acreage. It was this big room, it was like a mini ballroom. And you had this sort of desk…

James: It was a massive room with a fireplace. By far the biggest room in the house.

Tim: You’d had these desks all facing the wall. And it was sort of a little bit like mission control. You had this big white board that I think went for about 124, 25 meters.

James: It was so big it doesn’t fit in my house and I sold it.

Tim: Yeah. And then I think I just would sit on the floor. And then we did a couple of episodes, I think, driving. You were driving me to the airport.

James: Yup.

Tim: But they were good.

James: Done it all.

Tim: Even back then.

James: Done it all. We had a little Japanese restaurant on the way through.

Tim: Yes. Yeah, yeah. Even back then, I liked the idea of face to face. I’m doing a lot more face-to-face stuff on The Small Business Big Marketing Show. In fact, I had a member of my forum only yesterday ask with a recent interview, I did I was face to face, because the energy and the interaction was so much more personal. And I am, I’m actually going into a radio studio in Melbourne and recording my show these days. And despite the fact that I just dropped 800 bucks on a new mic, but that’s OK. That’s cool.

James: You know, in terms of return on investment, that’s a pretty cheap mic. Probably cost you one cent per episode.

You know, one of my favorite episodes was when we recorded live at our live event.

Tim: Aw, that was a lot of fun.

James: That was fun. We were laughing, we had questions. I tried that again. I did it with Ezra for ThinkActGet. And on that one, he put down his mic and he said, “I got to go take a pee.”

Tim: Why? Just because?

James: From the stage. Yeah. It was like, ‘Wow, I haven’t had that happen before. I’ve never had a presenter need to go to the bathroom part-way through a show.

Tim: I think that feels a bit too cool for school for me.

James: It was funny.

Tim: Hey? Leaves the co-host high and dry.

James: Yeah. OK, hi everyone. It’s like the time I was repossessing a guy’s car. And the whole family ran out and caught me while we were breaking into the car and putting it on the tow truck. And they were all staring at me, this huge family of islanders just staring at me. I’m like, “Hi, you’re probably wondering what I’m up to.” And I had to explain. It was extra bad because this guy didn’t even know that it was financed. He had bought it from someone who got financed.

Tim: So this is your new stuff, like you’re stopping Freedom Ocean because you now have a repossession business and this is what you’ve been doing the last couple of weeks?

James: Yeah, I’ve had a secret hankering to go back to the old gig from the early 90s. No, I’ll leave that parked in the early 90s.

Tim: That’s it.

James: That was fun. I’ll just keep the stories but everything else is changed.

Tim: Yeah. No, fair enough, mate. Well Jimmy, we could just kind of talk like this forever. We might, but we probably should hit Stop because I think there’s three people left listening. And they’re the Freedom Ocean groupies. They’ve been with us forever. But we should thank those who have tuned in over the years to the 84 episodes. Thanks for your comments. Thanks for your feedback. Thanks for pushing us to do more episodes. And well done. Thanks for the team. Team, team, yeah?

James: Thanks to the team for producing them and uploading them and sharing them and keeping the website alive.

Tim: And well done to anyone listening who has actually implemented anything that Jimmy and I have shared, and you’ve gone on to do bigger and better things. Because you know, James used the word earlier of “education,” that’s what we set out to do. You know, I set out to educate myself and we set out to educate anyone who chose to listen to a show that was all about creating an online business. So well done if you have done that. I get an email every now and then. In fact, I got one this week, Jimmy, of a listener who has created a seven-figure business from listening to my other podcast, and I go, ‘That’s kind of nice.’

James: It’s excellent. Freedom Ocean absolutely was the number one source of people finding my business for the last five or six years. And it’s been a great ride and thank you Tim for approaching me with the idea, showing me how podcasts work and putting together these episodes. You’re a legend.

Tim: Good on you. Thank you buddy. Well, our friendship doesn’t stop here. It’s got another couple of days left in it but…

James: [Laughs] Yeah, I’m good till the top of the hour.

Tim: That’s right. Call me Saturday, I’m not answering. Love it.

Alright, buddy. Hey everyone, thank you. FreedomOcean.com. By the way, poorly-named podcast. We didn’t realize that until a few episodes in, but we’d get lots of emails from people saying, “What is it? Is it “Free To Motion?” What’s that about? No, no, Freedom Ocean. So tip, when you’re naming something, make sure the syntax is right, the flow of the letters, you know, one leads into the other easily. All that type of stuff. But it is FreedomOcean.com is where you’ll find all past episodes, all 84 episodes and anything else we’ve put there. Jimmy, it’s been an absolute pleasure. Virtual hug mate, little kiss on the cheek. Bit of bromance, all that type of stuff. And thanks for being a part of the Ocean.

James: See you, Timbo.


  1. Farewell dudes, thanks for the episodes. Always better to leave with people saying why… may your hammocks always sway in the breeze.

  2. Jim Knott says

    Guys – big THANK YOU for all the episodes. I was plunged into the Freedom Ocean at Fast Web Formula 3, listened to them all from #1 and kept listening.
    GREAT content in a wonderful format.
    It was interesting to see/hear you both influence each other to where you are now.
    I look forward each week to Small Business Big Marketing and Super Fast Business listening as I walk our cat (yes we walk the cat each night !!??).
    FYI – the cat is called “Ocean”
    Wishing you every happiness in the future.
    THANKS and take good care, – Jim Knott.

  3. davidandrewwiebe says

    Sad to see this podcast go. I got a lot of value from it, and really liked where you took the conversations. I don’t know if there is anything quite like it out there in terms of the value it offers. Thank you James and Timbo for all your hard work. James, I’m already listening to all your other podcasts. Timbo, I subscribed to yours. Thank you for leading by example and simplifying your business life. It gives me inspiration to do the same, and to keep this in mind as I move forward.

    Again, thank you so much for sharing your wisdom with us.

  4. Nice comments, I would also to say ‘thank you very much’ for the free content. However it was the great banter between Tim & James that made it a very special podcast, I, like many others, hanging on until the next
    one… & listened to all…. even though a member of SFB and peruse Tim’s Podcast list to see what’s on.

    Nowdays with maybe 15-20 varying podcasts on my list, this was the most entertaining by a good margin… (educate and entertain as Andrew Lock said the other day at SFB in Sydney!)

    Guys are you aware of the 5 stages of grief: – Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression, Acceptance?? I’ve quickly gone to the bargaining stage; – maybe if lots of the listeners paid 100-200 USD/year or more each, you guys could continue a monthly podcast, but not enough money to interest you guys, I guess? You could still give the monies to your favourite charities?? Or why not do 2-3 encores by expanding on the most interesting past topics that are still current?
    All wild speculation. Maybe better take a tip and start “essentialising” my own life and quickly move from the next stage of depression into acceptance
    Otherwise the best people get off at the top, like you guys have!
    Thanks again ! Cheers & Beers !

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