#58 Giving People What They Want


Welcome back listeners to episode 58 of Freedom Ocean. Fresh back from Vietnam and the Philippines, Timbo and James talk about their trips, lessons learned (by Tim), getting richer and a great new feature that’s boosting stats in Freedom Ocean.

Kids eat free

In this podcast:

  • What unimaginable horror happened to Tim in Vietnam?
  • The Paradox of Choice
  • What billionaires do to get richer
  • Lesson: Two questions you need to answer
  • Starting something totally new vs catering to existing needs
  • New landing page feature for first-time visitors using this


Internet Marketing Products & Resources

Here you’ll find Tim and James have some things to help your business become more powerful.





Tim:                Good day, everyone! And welcome back to Episode 58 of Freedom Ocean. I am Timbo Reid. Right there, fresh back from the Philippines, is James Schramko. I’m actually fresh back from Vietnam. How are you, mate?

James:            Good, thank you. And I actually brought my iPhone back from holidays. How about you?

Tim:                Gee, you’ve gone straight for the jugular…straight for the jugular.

James:            Well, I was looking at my Facebook as you do. I saw your… you had your ‘Good Morning, Vietnam’ post which is great.

Tim:                Funny…

James:            A few little tasty treats.

Tim:                Live duck eggs..

James:            They didn’t look quite as nice as the burger we had on our last episode.

Tim:                No, it didn’t.

James:            However, where you on the phone when they grabbed it? What happened?

Tim:                Ok, so what happened was.. I was in Vietnam giving a talk for an Australian Bank, finished that, tagged some days on to have a bit of fun. And standing on the side of the street one day, looking down at my iPhone 5 in the Google Maps and there’s two young boys on a motorbike came along, stopped in front of me, snatched it out of my hand, drove away, and gave me a wave.

James:            Oh, so, they gave you a wave.

Tim:                See you, Timbo, got your phone, thank you! Hopefully we can crack into it and rob you of everything you’ve ever owned. But mate that was…look… interesting lesson here, bringing you back to the whole world of business and online and all that type of stuff is just how secure is all that data. Because I…you know what…it happened about 7 o’clock one night and I was heading off to dinner with, help me with names here, Dan and Ian from Internet Lifestyle podcast?

James:            Lifestyle Business podcast.

Tim:                Lifestyle Business…I was heading off to meet them at a restaurant and all of a sudden, Timbo’s phone’s gone. The address of where I’m meeting them’s gone. And I just had to go back to the hotel room and spend about an hour and a half, two hours changing passwords, locking the phone, just you know, just doing stuff. And what really…I mean, look it’s a phone, you know, easily replaceable, no worries. But it was the pain of changing all that. They had immediately started to try to hack into certain accounts because I was getting e-mails saying, ‘Someone’s trying to hack into your account’. So I got through that. I use LastPass on my computer. So like it’s the last password you ever need. And I hadn’t installed it on my iPhone and that would have been so much easier, James.

James:            So tell me, Timbo. Does your phone sort of automatically turn on the password after a minute or so?

Tim:                It does now.

James:            Oh now, so you didn’t. It was just open access wasn’t it?

Tim:                Yeah, open access.

James:            If I leave mine for just a minute, it goes to the password.

Tim:                I know. I know. I’m a trusting fellow…not anymore. As soon as I see a motorbike, I go and put my phone under my pillow. Crazy place. Hey, just an interesting lesson. So look, clearly, just get your passwords in order. And probably, I don’t know, do you use LastPass or do you use one password?

James:            I use one password on my Mac. The team use LastPass and we used to use PassPack. So we just kept the other one that’s popular’s RoboForm. Now, I also don’t use the same password on anything. So, I’ve different levels of passwords; there’s passwords that only I know, there’s some passwords that the team know, but most of them are in LastPass.

Tim:                Is anything you use, does anything you use have the password ‚Timbo‛?

James:            Nothing.

Tim:                Give me something. Give me something. Hey, I’ve given you a marketing lesson from eBay and you’ve just been in a crazy Asian country and so have I. And it is crazy. It is a completely…it’s mind-blowing. I’m personally, you’ve probably got a sense of my Facebook updates whilst I was there. I mean, it’s just eye-opening. One of the things that I found really just doesn’t work for me is too much choice. I had to go and buy the kids presents and you go into these shops. You know it might be a t-shirt shop or whatever it is, and there’s just lots of everything. And I just find that whole concept of offering lots very…it doesn’t help the consumer, you know.

James:            No, there’s even a name for it from the testing this famous jam test and I think it’s called the paradox of choice and that is, if you have too many choices, we just sort of lock up and we just end up saying, ‘Oh screw it, I’ll just do nothing’.

Tim:                Yeah. Yeah you absolutely do. And that jam test is a ripper. They started off, it was a jam manufacturer end of the supermarket aisle. Thought that’d be really cool and you know, please everyone by having 24 flavors of jam and then they realized they weren’t getting any sales, they weren’t selling anything. And anyway, through process of elimination and reducing the number of flavors, I think the optimal sales came from 3 flavors?

James:            Yeah. Well, just limit it down. I had the same thing at the hotel that I’m staying at in the Philippines. The buffet breakfast was incredible. The pastry table, the sushi table, because they cater for their Asian customers from Japan and Korea and China. And then the miso soups and the noodles. And then they have the traditional stuff all the way all the way through the meats, the cold meats, the hot meats, the salads, the omelets, the…

Tim:                Hold my legs I’m going in.

James:            So, you said that. And now I’ve been away for three weeks. And I’ve just weighed back in and I’ve only put on about half a kilo, and it’s probably just from swelling up in the airplane. I’m proud of that so I’ve kept myself under control. I found a good routine while I was away. It was, drink water, have coffee with no milk and sort of do semi fasting. I was having a pretty reasonable breakfast but most days I only ate one other meal, sometimes just a very light evening snack.

Tim:                Geez! I didn’t. That said, that said, I didn’t actually. I was pretty good. I’ve come home sick, got me old belly. And ah was a bit crook on the plane and in the last few days. Haven’t been overly well but I just think it’s all the walking and what can you do in a country like Vietnam?

James:            No, I think. I’ve figured it out now. It’s dehydration. When you go to somewhere like that, you just got to keep drinking until you need to go to the toilet and if you don’t, you will dehydrate and first signs are, you get stomach cramps and then diarrhea. And, you know, it took me a couple of trips to figure that. I thought it was the water or whatever but it’s just not drinking enough and I actually get these little sachets that I put in my water bottle and I just go on those for the whole time while I’m away. I haven’t been sick for the last three or four trips now.

Tim:                Well, I ate off the streets. Not literally off the streets, but you know…

James:            Oh mate. I was out in the province. Sitting out in someone’s ‘kubo’, eating the local chicken adobo and pork belly made on a little hibachi and the local beer. It was amazing.

Tim:                Could you…just bring this back to business because first time listeners have all just turned off going…

James:            Yeah. They’ve gone.

Tim:                But, there are lessons everywhere, mate. And one of the things that I did while I was there, in fact, just interesting to see the power of social media. We had that social media discussion last episode and just that whole, you know, other people’s opinions are possibly the most important aspect of much of our marketing. You know, people say word of mouth but I tend to think that word of mouth is the result of great marketing. I had three or four days on the back end of my talk in Ho Chi Minh and never been there before. Didn’t know what to do, didn’t have a plan. So, two days from leaving, I put on trip advisor, the question: ‚What are some cool things to do in Ho Chi Minh? I’m not into war.‛ So, because there’s a lot of war stuff there that you can do. So, I got about 18 responses and was put in touch.

One of the ones that kept on coming back was a company called…I said I was into food. I was really interested in Vietnamese food, so a lot of people came back and said you’ve got to do this thing called XO Tours and this is where it gets really interesting because here’s a little small business, in Viet…in Ho Chi Minh City who have cranked…who are cranking it on Google and so here’s the process. And feel free to interrupt at any point, James. So, I get recommended on TripAdvisor, XO Tours. Cool! I go and Google. The first thing I’d do, I thought. What I’ll do is Google Food to Ho Chi Minh City and see who comes up. Beyond trip advisor, they’re the first ones- XO Tours. I’m thinking, they’re pretty good. I go to their website. It’s a website that just tells you what you need to know, right? No puffery. It just has the packages. It has some testimonials, which I think is really important when you’re going into a foreign city. It had the ability to pay online. It had a nine minute YouTube tour, YouTube video. Went and checked out their YouTube. Went and checked out their Facebook. An incredibly social, social business this was. I then was able to book online and pay via PayPal. I got a confirmation e-mail immediately and then a follow-up manual e-mail from the owner within four hours. They had an add-on, which I love. It was on the back, these food tours were on the back of a bike. So you hop on the back of the motorbike with a traditional, a girl, wearing traditional Vietnamese costume or traditional Vietnamese…is that what you say, costume, dress, whatever? You hop on the back of a bike and they take you around. And you have the option of having someone follow you with a video camera, extra 30 bucks. Nice little value, eh?

James:            Yup.

Tim:                That point in time I had my phone and boy oh boy I was looking out for the blind…because it’s a city of 11 million people.

James:            Do they also catch phone thieves? Phone retrieval.

Tim:                Following the tour, they asked us to leave a comment on TripAdvisor. They send us a feedback form. Just a good experience, you know. And sometimes. It’s not brain surgery, is it?

James:            No. It’s simple. Just give people what they want.

Tim:                Hey, you know what? We haven’t planned this episode. But God that’s a good segue into what you did to what I want to talk about.

James:            What are we talking about?

Tim:                Well, we’re into it. We’re already into it. Things that will help improve people’s business particularly online but coming home in the plane, I’m reading Forbes Asia. You know that fancy magazine? And the lead article is Billionaires: The names, the numbers and the stories behind the 1,426 who steer Vast Enterprises, right? So I’m going, Gee that’d be interesting. 14 hundred billionaires in the world. So I turned into the editorial page and the editor who was Steve Forbes, the headline is, ‚They succeed by meeting our needs‛.

James:            That’s it.

Tim:                Eh?! Not brain surgery?

James:            It’s not really. It’s not. And I see people complicating this all the time.

Tim:                Yup. Well, we can be good at that. I’ll put my hand up for doing that sometimes.

James:            I saw a sign just before, I was out getting a coffee, and it said, ‚Children eat for free‛. I’m thinking, that’s really good for parents. How…

Tim:                Here we go, disclaimer..

James:            What’s the disclaimer?

Tim:                No disclaimer?

James:            Between 5:30 and 6:30 P.M. , child’s meal free with every adult meal purchased. Right, so, if you’ve got kids and you want to go to a little coffee shop in the afternoon, after the school pick up, this becomes attractive and this is not that far from the local school. And as many many other coffee shops in the area. In fact, you and I have had a coffee at this coffee shop.

Tim:                Ah! That fancy one.

James:            Yeah. I think that’s clever.

Tim:                I think it’s really clever.

James:            I’ve never seen that before.

Tim:                Give them what they want.

James:            Yeah, mums with kids.

Tim:                You know one of the billionaires listed in this 1426 list, the bloke who’s invented GoPro.

James:            That is just hot hot hot. I see GoPro now in stock again signs everywhere around Manly. They sell out. Apparently there’s a really hard to get supply.

Tim:                Wow! Mate, is he rocking it or what?

James:            Do you think it’s because I put my GoPro Archery video up….. Most likely, it’s earned more than likely, that’s the reason.  

Tim:                Has he made contact with you? I’m just trying to find what his name is. Nick Woodman. Nick Woodman.

James:            Ah, Nick Woodman. I don’t think he’s contacted me yet. It’s just a matter of time.

Tim:                Well, there’s a photo of him hanging out of a biplane with all these GoPros mounted and he’s got a FastWebFormula 4 t-shirt I can’t figure that out. Who would have thought?

James:            I was actually at the mall last trip to Manila and there was this guy there with a FastWebFormula 3 t-shirt and I don’t know who he is. It’s just, randomly, someone in the crowd had one of the t-shirts from my event.

Tim:                Did you go up to him and say, ‚Do you know who I am?‛

James:            I didn’t. I didn’t. I thought if it was you, you would. I actually had someone with me from the team, I said, ‚Who is that?‛ And she said, ‚I don’t know. I don’t know who that is‛.

Tim:                But how is that? I think Nick Woodman, I think he’s 32.

James:            He deserves it. I’ve got a GoPro. They’re fantastic.

Tim:                Do you use your GoPro for your marketing videos or you just use it for leisure?

James:            I say leisure. I’ve seen a nice video that Pat Flynn did of throwing his GoPro in the air and back and put it on slow mo. I’ve done some GoPro of archery, and also the classic one is the remote control car – we strapped it to the top of the remote control car.

I’ve got a whole range of crashes and experiments that we did with that one.

Tim:                You crazy guy!

James:            I’m also looking to have GoPro around Manly dam on my dirt bike…on my mountain bike to see how that looks.

Tim:                One of my boys wanted one for Christmas. From Santa. Nah, we’ve had that discussion. And I just thought, you’re just going to end up with a whole lot of crappy footage that you’re never going to do anything with.

James:            That’s not much different to a camera. And you know, you can just delete it.

Tim:                Geesh! I sounded like a harsh dad then, didn’t I?

James:            It is.

Tim:                That’s what I said to him.

James:            Does he know about the Grinch?

Tim:                Yeah yeah yeah. He’s calling me Scrooge lately. So, ah I did something there. But that’s interesting isn’t it, give them what they want. And the rest takes care of itself. And you say we complicate things. And I think you’re right. So, I think probably the lesson there is, two questions to ask all of us, every listener: Are you giving your customers what they really really want? or what you think they want? And is it delivered in a simple, uncomplicated way?

James:            That is a great set of questions. One, a great exercise to do is to imagine the perfect experience for your customer and I think our friend Dean Jackson talks about this a fair bit. Dean Jackson hangs out with Joe Polish. But I like that exercise and it was actually that exercise that led me to providing the free website check on my SEO business, which later turned into a 20 dollar website check and the stats on that were phenomenal. I’ll be sharing that at my event but the bottom line is, I get exactly the same number of orders even though some people pay for it. But we reduced our number of inquiries significantly.

Tim:                Yeah right.

James:            But with no difference to the number of actual customers. And I’ve been reading a pre-release book by Perry Marshall at the moment and it really hops on about the 80/20 rule. And it just goes to show that the vast minority of your customers are accounting for the vast majority of your income. And it’s fractual, which means that very few of your customers are probably generating the most amount of your sales. And it’s a matter of just selecting them. And he says, Sales is a disqualification process which is almost like reading out everything you don’t want and eliminating that waste and just focusing on the customers who are good and are going to spend the money. And if you think about this, it’s everywhere in our business even with opt-ins, and the people who don’t opt-in or never open your e-mails are not the ones to worry about. They’re the wasted ones. The ones that you’re just not resonating with.

So, if you can go to an already existing product that you have or an existing service and figure out who’s buying it, you’ll find that there’s probably some of your customers ten or a hundred times more pro-active than the average person on there. So, averages are very misleading. Bell curve is ridiculous. He talks about the power curve where the people who are talented and the people who are your most avid customers are spending not just like 2 or 3 times, they’re like 10 or a hundred, like 50 times more powerful.

Tim:                Yup.

James:            Well, you probably have the same customers repeat book you and they’ll be so much more valuable to you than your little customers. So you could take them out to dinner or to a Golf game or send them a GoPro as a gift.

Tim:                Talking about this on Small Business, Big Marketing the other day to…just the wealth that exists in your existing customer base versus chasing new customers. Again, you know, just tapping into a mining or whatever that jargon is.

James:            I’ll tell you how simple this is.

Tim:                Here we go.

James:            When I was in the Philippines last week and I met with my SEO Team, I logged into my payments dashboard, I took a screenshot of the top 10 customers, and then I just sent them each a personal e-mail from me, just saying, ‚Hey, what would you like us to provide you?‛, you know, ‚What would make the experience better?‛ and most of them hit Reply and told me. From that, we’ve made the majority of our innovations in the last few days that have changed our business. We’ve changed some price points, we’ve changed how we deliver some of the products. They’ve even had some amazing ideas like you know, ‚Can you reverse the ticket order, I’d like to see the most recent jobs first‛. Just a simple thing like that can change your entire business overnight and these are the most valuable customers. So, you pay attention to what they’ve got to say.

Tim:                Love it, Mate. That’s a great idea. Screenshot top 10 customers. Call them or e-mail them. What can we do better?

James:            Or visit them if it’s practical.

Tim:                Oh! Thought it was all virtual. Now, Jimmy, let’s move on. We have a question from Chris Hanson who by the way has written this. I don’t think he’s expecting an answer. So, I might read the entire e-mail. Suffice to say, he’s pointing the finger at you James.

James:            I hope so. I hope I’m polarizing. I don’t know if it’s good or bad.

Tim:                Get your back up. Get your back up. ‚According to James…‛ hey? already your back’s a little bit up.

James:            Little bit leading in.

Tim:                According to James, no one should ever start anything unproven unless it’s already out there. Which only begs the question, James, how do we move forward and push boundaries if we only wait? Yeah, put that in your pipe and smoke it, Jimmy.

James:            Well…

Tim:                Are you giving the wrong advice?

James:            Maybe, if it’s everyone. I mean there are still artists out there who want to create stuff, but they may not be commercial. Maybe I would qualify that, and I don’t know what the original statement was, so I can’t assume that it’s entirely…we could cast a little bit of doubt on that, I’m not going to make that presumption. But if I said something along those lines, it would simply be that there’s already a lot of money changing hands out there, so why not just figure out what that is and step in front of the customers.

It’s quite easy to do, I’ve just been doing an experiment lately. I found a need from a customer, because they ask me more than a few times, I found a supplier for that need, who has asked me how to market their product, and I’ve just stepped in the middle of it. I get paid, the customer orders from me, I then order supply from my supplier, and I make a profit margin. And that’s such an easy, simple business, rather than have to go and educate everyone in the world about my great product and about how amazing it is. And I was watching this movie on the plane, on the way here, I can’t remember the name of it, but the guy’s an inventor and he ends up having to take his mum with him. I mean I’d already watched every other movie on the plane, so I’ll give it that caveat. And he’s basically wheeling around between Kmart and Costco and trying to convince them to buy his stuff. You know, and he’s doing it the hard way. He already had ten thousand bottles, with the labels printed, sitting at home, and he had to then go and try and sell it. So I would suggest that he read ‚’The Lean Startup‛ and work with a minimum viable startup. So the best way to know that your product is going to work is you get someone to pay you for it first and then make it. That’s all I’m saying. If you want to make money, and if you want to just make things easier for yourself, work with the stuff that people already buy.

Tim:                I think when Chris got that notion where you said that no one should ever start anything unproven unless it’s already out there, I remember in an earlier episode of Freedom Ocean we talked about the idea of go to Google, key in a keyword related to the business you want to enter and see how much activity there is around it, see how many Google adword campaigns there are, and if there’s lots, then it’s a busy marketplace, there’s lots of money changing hands, go for it. If there’s none, or very few adwords, then leave it alone. I don’t know, but that’s maybe where Chris got that notion from.

James:            Yeah, and even inventions and stuff are quite often just a repurposing of things. Like the GoPro. I mean, cameras have been around for a long time. He just made it cool, and clever, and marketed well and packaged and it’s a good product and he’s made a lifestyle out of the whole thing. From memory, they have customers submitting their best GoPro videos and they use those in their marketing as well.

Tim:                With Chris, and I won’t read Chris’s – it’s quite a long email, but my advice or suggestion… Chris is very – he’s got an idea, and he’s very passionate about it, he’s very excited about it, and the fact that no one else is doing it is maybe stopping him from actually leaning in and actually just immersing himself in it, but you know passion’s great, I think passion’s a wonderful thing and without passion it’s hard to move forward, but passion can also be dangerous because when you’re passionate, you don’t look out for the dangers, yeah? So, you can become blinded.

James:            You can become blinded to – you can put a lot of time and resource into stuff that’s never going to get you anywhere, so the main thing to ask first is “What is the point?” If the point is maximum commercial profitability with the minimum effort, then it won’t tick that box. You’d have to be lucky for it to work that way. However, If the point is you are just mad keen about this thing, you want to do it anyway, and you won’t sleep until you know whether it’s viable or not and you just have to do it, then nothing we say is going to stop him. I think from memory he was feeling down about it, and I said, “Look, don’t feel sad”. In fact the idea that he suggested, there were already people doing that. I’ve even visited a shop in France that has what he’s talking about selling. So it’s already in play, so what it actually is a case of is he hasn’t done enough research yet.

Tim:                I remember coming across a guy who actually wanted to be interviewed by me. He’d come up with an idea which was pretty simple, and the way he got it to market was this: The idea was that, at a point in time, he wanted to open up a bottle of beer, didn’t have a bottle opener. He had an iPhone, with an iPhone case on it. Wouldn’t it be cool if there was a bottle opener embedded into the iPhone case? So what he did was, the first thing he did was he went onto his Facebook and asked, “Do you think this is a good idea?” Which, yeah, sometimes, why not, give it a go, but don’t lay your entire decision based on whether people say yes or no. In this case, he got a lot of traction pretty quickly with people going, “Yeah”, “Hell, yeah!” “Yeah, how many time do I have a beer and don’t have a bottle opener and grab an iPhone?” So you’d go, “Ok, well there’s something there”. So he then went to Ellie Barber, and he found a crowd in China who prototyped the case for six hundred bucks. So I think in the end, he might have dropped a thousand dollars, right? When he approached me, he had – and basically for six hundred bucks he got his first prototype, he tried it out, the middle kept on bending, but by the time he’d spent a thousand bucks he’d actually at least perfected or got very close to a product that was very functional, worked, looked good, blah blah. So he spent a thousand bucks, he got some nods on Facebook, he then took it to market, by the time he’d approached me he’d sold ten thousand of these puppies at forty dollars a unit.

James:            Wow. Well I suggested to Chris to go and check out Kickstarter. And that’s a place where you can help get funding from other people.

Tim:                Did you respond to his email?

James:            Yeah, I did.

Tim:                Oh, you’re good like that.

James:            Oh, I did, I responded straight away.

Tim:                You are the father of FreedomOcean. Well no, you’re the mother.

James:            I nurture it.

Tim:                You’re the nurturer.

James:            I look after the website, post production and stuff. I do respond to every single email.

Tim:                MotherOcean. Mother James.

James:            I notice you’ve asked someone else to mother hen your LinkedIn group, and I was curious about that.

Tim:                Yeah, yeah.

James:            Any takers?

Tim:                Yeah, lots.

James:            Really? I’m just thinking – like my first reaction is, if you want someone else to look after it, what will you be doing? (laughs)

Tim:                Running my forum, that’s what I’ll be doing. Ah, no, look, you know what, it’s a good group, and there’s some really juicy discussion there, and I don’t want to close it. I’ve launched the SmallBusinessBigMarketing forum, and it’s going well, and there’s some great discussion in there. And it’s just me, I don’t have a big team, and I’m very clever. If any one wants to know how to spread yourself too thinly, just send an email to FreedomOcean.com

James:            (laughing) The Spread Too Thin Episode.

Tim:                Yeah, in fact I’ll create a – I think there’s a spread there, I might create a – I might get a package done. It’s called the Spread Too Thinly.

James:            Aw, it’ll be a seller.

Tim:                It would be a seller, wouldn’t it? Everyone will have t-shirts, will have – you know, there’s a whole lot of merch! We could create a whole lot of merch that would sell like nuts. We’d have a band called the Spread Too Thinlies.

James:            Yeah, we could get a celebrity endorsement.  

Tim:                (laughing) Yeah, that’s right.

James:            Or, we could just stick to selling stuff people are begging to buy.

Tim:                Well, I know there’s right now a lot of heads nodding as we talk about the Spread Too Thinlies. But, it was a good thing to do, it is a good thing to do, it’s a good discussion, it does allow me to have discussions with people who listen to my other podcast. It’s just that you know, when you do – it is only you, you’ve got to focus on the stuff that generates income, and LinkedIn is not one of those things, and now I have a forum that does. It does take up my time, because I’m in there every day, and from what I’ve seen, as you do build a tribe of people, there are other people who want to become involved, who want to be a part of it, not just from a listener or reader or watching point of view, but as a forum administrator. Or as someone who helps do whatever. I got probably eight responses and have chosen a fellow, Craig, who’s very kindly asked me for some KPI’s, James, I have to give him some KPI’s.

James:            A good team member will want to know their KPIs.

Tim:                Correct, correct.

James:            Now did you have a question for me about our opt-in page?

Tim:                I did, mate, let’s finish on that. So we always send our listeners off to FreedomOcean.com at the end of a show, which we are getting close to. And I noticed in going there just before we hit the Record button today, that you have got a new landing page. The team’s worked up a news landing page using LeadPages.

James:            Yup.

Tim:                Tell us about that.

James:            So this is using LeadPages which is an opt-in thing that integrates with our customer database, and the one that you’re seeing shows for first-time visitors to the home page. Once they’ve visited once, it shouldn’t show again. It’s called a welcome gate. And the idea is that if they haven’t been before, they might want to get onto our list. And we give them a bribe, which is that they will get the PDF transcriptions. We actually transcribe every single episode. Every extra word, someone’s typing that extra word. So even as I say “extra word, extra word, extra words”, someone’s just shaking their head, saying “Stop talking, James”.

Now if someone’s going directly to a post, like we link to it in an email, or if they’ve already been to this page, they shouldn’t see it. But on the chance that they do, we still put a convenient option which is “Skip this page”. If they don’t want to put their details, that’s fine. And we put an appropriate picture to match the theme of our show, which is an ocean, and I know you’re dying to ask me the stats, what’s happened to our stats, so we’ve had a 43.57% lift in opt-ins in the last – that was the last thirty days versus the thirty days prior. And the last part of that thirty days is when we put this in place, and the opt-ins have gone up significantly. We’re getting about three to four times more opt-ins, bottom line. It’s worth having for us, haven’t had anyone complain about it yet.

Tim:                What’s the cost of LeadPages?

James:            No idea. Whatever it is…

Tim:                It’s a monthly subscription, isn’t it?

James:            I think you can actually buy it. I think you buy an annual pro thing, I’m not sure. Honestly, when I bought it, and I did buy it, I got the maximum possible one because you know, I put it across all of my sites, and my leads have just gone through the roof. It’s just got the highest converting pages. There’s a number of reasons why. I’ve interviewed Clay Collins many, many times on my other podcast, and I’ve drilled him about everything down to the fact that these things – you know, that page is actually served from Google’s server, so it loads quickly on any device. That’s one of the great features about it.

Tim:                Why have you interviewed Clay many times?

James:            Pareto principle, Timbo.

Tim:                Aaaaah, there it is!

James:            Well, think about FreedomOcean. We’re talking all the time, you and I, you and I. We’re a good combo. I’ve had my other podcast –

Tim:                Some would say.

James:            Well, some would say. Others say we banter too much. Today, I’d probably agree. Good stuff today.

Tim:                I feel good about this episode.

James:            Yeah, we’ve had tourist travel tips, we’ve had all sorts of stuff.

Tim:                Correct. You don’t require me to find the business lesson in each, because you would just go down the trap of eating chicken.

James:            I would, I would. So, back to topic. Why I interview the same guy many times.

Tim:                Do you know what the Vietnamese call frog?

James:                        Frog.

Tim:    Jumping chicken.

James:                        Actually, I did see that. Well, you know what the Filipinos call peanuts?

Tim:                No.

James:            I’m not going to say it, because if you mispronounce it, it can also mean a female body part.

Tim:                Wooooh!

James:            So you’ve got to be very careful. So anyway, the thing is, I went and I’ve looked at the analytics from my podcasts, I see the downloads, I actually send you a screenshot of my downloads each week. People, they love Clay Collins. They listen to those episodes more than the other ones, they buy LeadPages every time I interview him. Basically it’s very popular with my audience and it’s very profitable for me, so I’d rather interview Clay several times than go and find other people who my audience may not have heard off or might not care to listen to as much.

Tim:                Obviously, he’s got lots to talk about, but for how long can you talk about a landing page?

James:            Oh, Tim, it’s such a fascinating thing.

Tim:                Aww, Jimmy, you love them, don’t you?

James:            Well lead capture – like, imagine that you can increase your conversions without any change in traffic, I mean that’s what we’ve just done to our site, but what people don’t know is about the split testing of it, or the two-step form, or what color, or what’s the highest performing call to action. Should you skip the page or not? Does it change it if you ask for the first name or not? Every time I speak to Clay there’s fascinating insights. I mean he’s just had a seven hundred percent increase on his sales page, and I asked him about that. Yeah, so I think he really delivers, and the fact is, people comment, they ask questions, and they download that podcast more than the other guests. So I’ll keep having him back until they say, “Can you stop interviewing this Clay?”

It’s kind of like a sub theme or a recurring loop on my SuperFastBusiness blog is I’ve just got interviews with Clay and we have –

Tim:                It’s like, “Clay, so what do you reckon? Nine and a half point or ten point Times New Roman?”

James:            No, it’s not. It’s like, you know, he’s got this Facebook thing. You can click on two buttons and push your squeeze page onto Facebook. On your page. Like we have a FreedomOcean opt-in on FreedomOcean.com. We should now go and put that on our FreedomOcean page, and it’s really just one button. So I’ll just –

Tim:                Can you do that, please?

James:            I’m going to have it done. So, did you know about that option?

Tim:                If I said “Yes”, I’d be lying.

James:            (laughs) See? That’s why I interview Clay. That was one of the episodes.

Tim:                Ah, love it. Love it. Love the name Clay, really.

James:            It’s a great name. And did you have good meet-ups in Vietnam?

Tim:                I did. Well, the big one that I was really looking forward to was meeting Dan and Ian, and that just didn’t happen, so that was disappointing.

James:            What, because you lost your phone? You didn’t actually get to meet them?

Tim:                I lost my phone, it was about two hours after I went back to my hotel, two hours of stuffing around cancelling stuff, blocking the phone, doing all that type of stuff, and then I was just annoyed. I gave up. I said, “Dan, tonight, Ho Chi Minh one, Timbo none”.

Alright mate, at the thirty eight or so minute mark, I’m going to look you in the eye, and say I love you like a brother, but that is the end of FreedomOcean episode 58.

James:            It’s been wonderful.

Tim:                Listeners – it has been wonderful – FreedomOcean.com, go and check out that landing page that we are talking about. That can result in multiple interviews if you are a podcaster, and keep

those voicemails and questions coming, we’ll tackle at least one in each episode going forward, so at least you and I have got something to talk about, hey?

James:            Perfect

Tim:                Good on you, mate, see you next time.

James:            See you.



  1. Guys, I have to say that this is probably the best episode I have heard for a while, it resonated with me. The discussion around the listener question and James’s poignant question “what is the point?” is the gold here. And I must say don’t stop the banter, its great and entertaining.
    Thanks again for a great show.

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