#22 A Micro-Site Gets Pulled Apart.


As Timbo pondered what to cover for this episode of Freedom Ocean he had the brainwave of getting James to comment on a micro-site that he had in development. Brave on Timbo’s behalf, but in the spirit of constant improvement, it’s an episode not to be missed for anyone in to developing highly effective micro-sites.

 The site we pulled apart is here:


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TIM: Welcome back, listeners to Australia’s most loved internet marketing podcast, which is called Freedom Ocean, by the way. I’m Timbo Reid, your host. And if I’m not mistaken, at the other end of the line would be James Schramko.

JAMES: I’m here, Timbo. I’m here.

TIM: How are you mate?

JAMES: Very good!

TIM: Good! Sunday afternoon, so you should be.

JAMES: (laughs) Why is that?

TIM: I don’t know! Well, there’s a particular feel about a Sunday on the Freedom Ocean.

JAMES: Yeah, I don’t know. Maybe my feelings about weekends are slightly different than other people might.

TIM: (laughs) They are, aren’t they?

JAMES: I definitely remember Sunday night. It was pull out the shoes, polish them up, watching 60 Minutes or whatever, getting ready for work the next day. And then that wave of frustration and resentment would start to creep in. And then I particularly hated Monday mornings.

TIM: So really the Freedom Ocean, there is no such thing as weekends and hump days and peak-out traffic and all that, is there?

JAMES: There’s still a little bit of that. You just have to be conscious that if you’re going to go into the shops or something, there might be other people there on the weekend. Because you can get quite used to having it your own way during the week.

TIM: Yep!

JAMES: I go on see a movie with my wife and we might be one of two or three couples in the entire place during the week. Middle of the day.

TIM: Do you have any set hours that you set yourself or—I know you often say to me you work better at night, but how do you structure such a lifestyle?

JAMES: Yeah, well this is really an interesting topic. I was having the same conversation with Ed Dale on my other podcast this week. And he doesn’t mind the 5-day, but I definitely don’t do that. I definitely don’t. I do have a routine but I tend to work with my body energy, you know. If I’m feeling down or tired, I just won’t do any work. If I feel really motivated, then I’ll just pour myself into it. So I think a routine actually sets you free.
So having some kind of schedule is good, but I’m not too tight with it. So I generally tend to start from ten-ish, and I put in a good, solid hour or two and then I’d take it easy for a while and do the whole school kid thing and not know quite if I’ll go and I’ll go and have a ride or do something other than work. And then I’ll usually get back into it sort of after 9:30 PM. My most productive time is probably that 10 o’clock to 1 or 2 in the morning. It’s very quiet, people are asleep, no one’s using the internet in my area, and I have a pretty slow connection, so the internet actually speeds up every hour it gets later.

TIM: Couple of extra kilobytes a second do you get?

JAMES: I do! I mean, the worst time for me to use the internet is 6:00 PM, 6 or 7 at night, because people are just coming home from school or work or loading up the internet connection around here.

TIM: For those who—I don’t know if I’ve mentioned this before to our listeners, James, but if I haven’t, excuse me for doubling out, but it’s a great reminder. You have one of the slowest internet connections in Australia, if not the world. So therefore—

JAMES: It’s second slowest internet connection available in Australia.

TIM: Where’s the slowest?

JAMES: Dial-up would be the slowest.

TIM: Well, gee, I tell you what, you’re almost close to it.

JAMES: It is pretty close.

TIM: So as in terms of an excuse for not performing as an internet marketer, anyone who’s listening, including myself, you cannot blame your internet connection because I can tell you right now, I have seen on many occasion, James’ speed or their lack of.

JAMES: Yeah, and I just cannot get a faster connection to this house. I’ve got two separate providers and that’s so I can at least download and upload on one computer, while I’m using the other one.

TIM: I love it as a headline, mate. Australia’s leading internet marketer has the slowest internet connection in the world.

JAMES: Yeah. It does make you more strategic, though, about what you plan to do while you’re online.

TIM: Yeah, absolutely! Absolutely! So now listen, mate. This is—we should get stuck into the content for what is Episode 22 of Freedom Ocean. And that is to talk—I guess it’s to talk about what I would call a micro-site strategy. And I’ve put together a micro-site for a client of mine with the primary intention of creating quality back links and driving traffic to my client’s money site, which is their main website. And I guess it’s secondary intention of ranking well in Google for getting word. So I’m putting myself on the line here, mate. On top of that, listeners, appreciated going by the feedback on our Facebook. The honesty of the Episode 21. So in the spirit of that, I’m going to expose myself again and show some of my work and I guess say what could be improved and what could be enhanced, okay?

JAMES: Alright. Let’s lay it on me. Tell me what to do.

TIM: Which we’ve got to be careful here, James, because podcasting is not a visual medium. And we will be talking about something visual. So each time we do talk about it, we’ll be clear as to what aspect of the website we’re talking about. But we’ll put a link to the website in the show notes. But the website is businessadvisormelvin.net.au. So people can go and have a look at that site. And as I said, first and foremost, the idea here is to create actually quite a lot of these little micro-sites that have lots of links back to my client’s main site. So I do want to ask questions. How do you want to do this, mate? Do you want to—

JAMES: My first question is: why are you doing that?

TIM: Why am I doing what?

JAMES: Why are you building a satellite site?

TIM: To create quality back links that are relevant within articles that are relevant to what my client does back to their main site. And also to rank well for, in this case, the keyword being business advisor.

JAMES: Hmm. It’s an interesting strategy. I mean, that’s something I would classify as a high leverage strategy for a mature site when you’ve got the primary site kicking butt. And I say that for a couple of reasons. First reason is, you’re probably better off sticking one page of content on the client’s actual site than putting one page of content on a third-party site because obviously you’ll lose some of the traffic coming through. Secondly, it’s just that easy to get good quality links from other places than to put a whole site up just for linking purposes is perhaps not efficient or effective.

TIM: If I were to say to you, though, that putting up this site—I wouldn’t call it a detailed website, but it’s actually a bit…it’s been a very easy process and a very, I’d say, cheap process as well. So in terms of labor and cost, it hasn’t been onerous.

JAMES: Good! There are other reasons to have secondary sites and the primary reason that I do it is to increase market share. And that is so I can rank multiple websites on the same phrase in Google. And this is how I came about with this strategy originally was to maximize market share so that when someone typed the key phrase that I was targeting, there would be my site and then my other site and then my other site. So in some markets—and you’ve seen me do this, Timbo—I have 4 or 5 sites for the same phrase on the first page of Google. And that’s a good leverage strategy. My question, I guess, would be: how effective this will be for this client? You know, what’s happening with their existing site? Have they already got the top rankings they need for the existing site and have they got enough content on there to become an authority?

TIM: The ranking’s okay. It’s an ongoing effect. We’ve just re-launched their main site. They’re ranking okay. Now it’s an ongoing mission, I suppose, to rank for keywords they’ve identified. Secondly, have they got content enough—no, they’ve got enough content on their main site, but once again, they’re regular bloggers, they’re about to start podcasting, so you know, they’re working on it. So is there anything wrong with doing having both things working alongside each other?

JAMES: No, only that in some cases there’s an argument for laser-focus on the one site. You know, you’d be better off to have one hundred pages on the one main authority site, than to have 10 sites with 10 pages, potentially. Because I think there’ll be a bias, especially from Google, to give more weight to the site that is a little bit bigger, that has a lot more content on it. And here’s something that is crucial to understand: every page is a new landing page, another opportunity for someone to arrive at the site. Because not all traffic comes to the homepage for site.
When people really get that, when they realize probably half the traffic to the site is going to come to the site of that homepage, it’s going to come in one of the landing pages that is specifically tailored to the search that someone is making. Then you realize that it’s okay to have a hundred pages on the primary site because if you are a business adviser and you were aiming to get traffic for people searching for tax planning, then you’d simply put up a tax planning page on your site, and that’s the page that Google will show for that tax planning Melbourne query, not the homepage in many cases.

TIM: As long as your anchor text for the back link is going to one of the sub-pages though, isn’t it?

JAMES: When you say anchor text, where from? From external or internal?

TIM: External.

JAMES: Right. So one of the other things that’s really important to understand is that you can have—the stronger SEO component might be to have an anchor text link from your existing site to a sub-page within the same site. That’s the fastest way to push your page up, is to link to it from an already existing page that is on that site.

TIM: So let me understand that. Let’s say there was a blog post on the primary site, the money site as I call it, talking about tax planning. And then where the word tax planning or tax planning accountant were mentioned, you would create that as an anchor text and link that to the page on the same site that talked about this service, the tax planning service?

JAMES: Exactly right! So for a business owner listening to this, or a service provider, the core idea here is this: your homepage is obviously your big, bold, you know, your main channel. And then you have a page on your site for each thing you’re trying to segment, and then you set up your blog and you write blog posts that point to the most relevant page with the correct anchor text. And if you’re sitting there wondering what anchor text is, it just means that the words that are linked to that page have the key phrase in it.

TIM: So is it really, is it major—it’s not major but a really important role of the blog is to give the opportunity to provide back links to other pages on the same site?


TIM: Yeah?

JAMES: Exactly right! You’re creating an iceberg here. You can see above the water, the landing pages that you want traffic to go to, and the bit below the water is all that content, the meaty content on that site, pushing people back to the landing pages that you want. So I’ve been doing this strategy for 5 years now, where you have a sales page and then a blog behind it pushing post after post back to the homepage or to the specific tailored landing page that you’re trying to attract people to.

TIM: Do Google, James, look at—let’s say there’s a blog post within the main site, the money site that is talking about tax planning. Talking about a tax planning accountant service, right? The 5 things that you should look for in a tax planning accountant. And then within that blog post there is a back link to another page on the website. There is also exactly the same anchor text and back link on an external micro-site to that page on the website. Does Google give greater weight into either of those back links or are they both equal?

JAMES: Well, I’m not a hundred percent certain, but I think it’s going to come down to the power of the page that you’re linking from. But I think on page optimization with this internal linking is pretty strong. And because you’ve got the most relevant content, it’s already trusted. It’s on theme or on topic. So yeah, that’s the fastest way to index a page under your site, is to link to it from the same site. But having both is the ultimate thing, you know. If you have external people, and in the third dimension, which is really starting to be important, is then having other people share it using things like the +1 button or the Facebook Like or the Tweet button, because now they’re going to start talking about the social rank of that site. And then there’ll be another dimension, which is the author rank which Ed Dale was talking about with me. And that’s where there are more
content from the same person you can get out there, the more that site will rank that actual person.

TIM: Wow! Explain that a bit more. Yeah, I don’t understand that.

JAMES: Don’t worry. Let’s not confuse it. But let’s go back to your original situation here. I’ve done what I do with everything is challenge the assumption in the first place. So keep in mind, you’re now starting up a second site and maybe potentially looking at more. You’ve indicated. Keep in mind it’s now three websites you’ve got to maintain that three websites you’ve got to build back links for. That’s 3 websites that you have to host and get domains renewed and administer plug-ins. So you are actually increasing the effort compared to just adding more content to the homepage, to the home site.

TIM: I feel as though…you know, absolutely! Everytime you add an additional asset, you’re adding workload. I feel as though I’ve got a pretty good process in place for this micro-sites because they’re not complicated sites. They’re literally, you know, we’ve uploading one new 400-word article per week and there are a number of them written in advance and they’re already uploaded in WordPress and scheduled to go live on dates. So, you know, yeah—

JAMES: It’s good, though, but you’re going to have to link to this site too, right?

TIM: Yeah. Yep!

JAMES: Now, if you’re going out and getting high PR sites like WordPress or Squidoo or Hubpages, and you’re linking to the primary site, that could be a good use for that article as well, instead of now you got two sites you’ve got to link to. So you’ve got to split your focus. And you know how I know this? Because I have so many sites, it literally takes us weeks to go around our sites and update plug-ins, you know. So the more domains that you commit to, the more websites you commit to, the more resource hungry they will be. Excellent to have a process. It’s good that you know the reason why you’re doing this. And I think, ultimately, the reason why you should do this will be to have more market share for the hot key phrases. But just know that you will have to put time and money into updating and linking and maintaining and grooming these sites.

TIM: Okay. Alright. Well—

JAMES: Before you go on and make 10 of them, get the first couple going.

TIM: Yep! Yeah, and now, well, we have. And I have. I was actually really surprised to see how quickly it started ranking for the term business adviser. Literally within a week it was sort of finding its way onto page 2 of Google for the phrase, and now, as of just before turning on, hitting record for this episode, it was ranking number 1 on page 1 for organic searches for that term.

JAMES: And what about the home site?

TIM: Well, business adviser is just one of a number of things I do. But they are ranking has improved as well for the home site.

JAMES: Cool. We’ll move on to the actual site itself. So we talked about strategy behind it.

TIM: Yep!

JAMES: And I’m not saying it’s a bad thing to do, but I’m giving you some reasons why you might want to consider the future steps to decide how far you’re going to commit to this.

TIM: Yeah, right. Okay.

JAMES: Second thing I noticed is the name of the business is slightly different to the domain by one letter.

TIM: (laughs) Ah, yeah, right. Got ya! Well, good pickup! Yep! But that is the domain’s right, obviously, and the banner. The banner said Business Adviser in Melbourne. So, yeah, I feel a bit embarrassed right now but we’ll move on. (laughs)

JAMES: (laughs) So one of them is not correct, is that right?

TIM: Well, the domain’s right. Businessadvisermelbourne.net.au, and the banner should say Business Adviser Melbourne, but it says Business Advisory.

JAMES: Aha! I just wanted to check that because obviously that—

TIM: Thank you.

JAMES: For SEO purposes. If it was actually advisory, that would be a different kettle of fish.

TIM: Yep!

JAMES: Okay. Next thing is you went with .net.au. What was the purpose for that?

TIM: It wasn’t a choice actually. It was something that client already had.

JAMES: Okay. Good to know.

TIM: Yep!

JAMES: But was the .com.au available?

TIM: Don’t know.

JAMES: Because that would be a premium domain versus the .net. And if it was available for that whole $20 or whatever it will cost, you would definitely want to buy it to protect the domain.

TIM: Yep!

JAMES: And luckily you’ll be able to do that before this podcast airs (laughs)

TIM: (laughs) Yeah, yeah, yeah, that’s right!

JAMES: So this is just another, you know, again I always go for the big picture first to make sure that I got the broad brush strokes right. So, you know, you definitely would rather be doing on a .com.au than a .net.au from a brand perspective. It shouldn’t make any difference to the rankings. And that may very well be the next site that you produce in this line of thinking.

TIM: Well, I can tell you now, I just checked and it’s gone.

JAMES: Okay. Maybe they own it.

TIM: No they don’t.

JAMES: Alrighty. Now, okay, next step is I noticed that the site currently has advertising on it in the form of Google Ads, AdSense. Tell me about that choice.

TIM: Yeah, well that was an overly-strategic decision. I thought, you know what, part of me probably thought that Google might like that and it might help the SEO. And the other part where the most serious part just thought might be a good way to generate some additional income.

JAMES: Okay. Now, how do you generate additional income from ads?

TIM: By having people click on them and leave your site. (laughs)

JAMES: Right. And so how does that help your customer?

TIM: Yep! Yep!

JAMES: Is it not the opposite of what you’re trying to achieve? Who owns this site?

TIM: A company called SP Solutions.

JAMES: Right. So whose AdSense are on the site?

TIM: Theirs.

JAMES: Gotcha! Now, what you’ll see is people who are in Melbourne will most likely see the customer’s competitors advertising on there.

TIM: Well, we’ve actually been able to—you can actually be selective about the categories of ads that appear. So we’ve made sure that other accountants’ ads don’t appear on it.

JAMES: I’m looking at it and I’m seeing financial planners business strategy investment.

TIM: Yep! Yep! They’re all non-competitive.

JAMES: Right. Okay. I mean, what we would do for a lead generation site like this is we would be putting a banner for the customer hoping that they’ll click on that to come to the site that makes us the most money, because chances are, you know, even if they make $2 or $3 a click for AdSense, they might be able to make $2,000 or $3,000 a customer for a lead.

TIM: Good point.

JAMES: The other question I have is how do people actually get to the customer’s core site? Because I can’t find a link.

TIM: If you go through the articles, there is one link per article back to the core site.

JAMES: I can’t see one on the first one there, the tax planning saves you money post.

TIM: Yeah, okay, there isn’t one. There is one on the next one.


TIM: (laughs) I feel like I’m in school here!

JAMES: No, that’s okay! If someone served me this up, these are the things I’ll be looking for. I’m like, “Okay.” Why they’ve done it. Tell me about the domain and interesting that there’s ads, okay what am I supposed to do on this site? And right now, above the fold, which means what can I see without scrolling, the only thing I can do on this site is either click away or I could click on an ad.

TIM: Well, they’re two of the same thing.

JAMES: Yeah. Now with your links, you might find it better to put in text links halfway through the article rather than just at the end.

TIM: Yeah.

JAMES: So we cause contextual text links. That’s where they’re just dropped within the text and I could show you some sites of mine, privately, that have in-text links. And they’re more valuable. If you get people approaching you to buy links for your site, they’re going to want a little text links somewhere within the article, not at the end, because it looks a lot more natural. So putting it at the end does a look a bit sales-y. But you should have the call to action at the end, but definitely link somewhere in the article, as well.

TIM: Is there such a concept as—I read about it a few weeks ago. But if you’ve got two links on a page going to the same external page, Google any recognizes the page, is that right?

JAMES: Well, that’s Leslie Rhodes’ first link preference.

TIM: Ah! It has a name!

JAMES: Yeah. But I don’t think that it’s widely agreed upon. I think that’s—he would probably say it’s factual, other people might say it’s theoretical. Ultimately, I don’t care. I’m after just a couple of relevant links back to the page and I don’t waste too much time theorizing about it. It’s good to have two or three links. Now, you’re doing these as posts by the look of it.

TIM: Correct.

JAMES: Right. So we’re going to click now. I’m going to click on a post. I’m going to check your permalink structure, which is how you’ve set the things up. And I can see that the post name is in the page title and the page title–so the page name and the page title have the key phrases, which is excellent.

TIM: Oh! Thank you! Ah, an elephant staff! The elephant staff!

JAMES: There’s two things I’d notice. One is there’s very few tags. You’ve got one tag for this article, and you can have probably 6 or 7 tags without any problem. There doesn’t seem to be any categories on this blog.

TIM: No, yeah, but right hand side.

JAMES: Yeah, but I’m just wondering how many categories you’ve ticked for each post. It doesn’t seem to show the categories in the post itself. In fact, interestingly, when I click on the category, it’s now showing me 3 AdSense blocks, which is the maximum. So you want to be careful not to violate the terms and conditions. I’m just wondering if there’s more posts in a particular category, if that will push it over the line, you know, if you have 4 or 5 posts in the category.

TIM: Yeah, right.

JAMES: You’ll have to keep an eye on that one as well. These are the little things we don’t think of until we get a warning letter.

TIM: So I take you got a warning, did you?

JAMES: Well, I guess so.

TIM: A cease and desist.

JAMES: No, no. It’ll be just something like, you know, you’re breaching the program terms. It looks like I’m checking here one that’s got more. It seems to have figured it out that it can only have three, so that’s good. So alright, the main things I’ve would change about this. Obviously, I’d get the correct name for the company. I would have, whether the powered by links seems to be linked back to the correct site, is that right? Well, that would be a really good place to put a big, clear call to action at the top right of
the page. And you could potentially do it on this site right now, on the top right in the right hand bar.

We got a categories widget. I would generally push that down and put the call to action there in a nice, at least 125 x 125 size banner. Sort of like we have on Freedomocean.com. If you, the listeners, go to Freedomocean.com, they’ll see on the right hand side, we have our call to action, which is to get our alerts. That’s the most important feature of that page, and it’s the most important spot. That’s where the eye rests when it gets to the right hand side of the page and stops. So that’s where the call to action should be. You should have something about that size as to get Freedom Ocean alerts panel, you should have that on this side with some very enticing copy. And it might be a headline, sub-headline, bullet points, and a clickable graphic.

TIM: A nice, old banner ad basically that points back to the money site.


TIM: Yeah. Yep! Do you think the images are too big?

JAMES: They’re okay but you might—I think the point is it’s good to have images in the posts. And that’s the element that’s nice. I think that you’re missing a huge opportunity by not linking the image.

TIM: Yep!

JAMES: People click on images. They get image-happy. So if you were to hyperlink each image to the customer’s destination page, that would be good. If you go to internetmarketingspeed.com, my other podcast, you’ll see that I link every image to something. And that is because from my heat map testing over the years, I know that people click-click on images.

TIM: What do you use for heat map testing?

JAMES: Well, I used to use Crazy Egg and now for any site when I’m split testing, it’s built-in to Visual Website Optimizer.

TIM: Well, James I reckon that’s a fair summary on the site that I should—I’m not getting defensive, but it’s something that went up, you know, about 3 weeks ago. And there is work to be done. And there’s some good done. That’s some good tips. But it actually sounds like, in summary, that it’s actually not a strategy that you’d pursue in the long-term. You’d be better off focusing on the main site.

JAMES: Well, more accurately I would say that it’s a strategy that I would be pursuing in the long-term but not the short-term. Because, you know, there’s a couple of contradictions here. Yes, it’s cheap to setup. Yes, it’s fast to get up. Yes, it’s getting reasonably good results. But wouldn’t that also be true of the main site, if you would spend the exact same time and energy on that, and then go and get a nice something PR 4 or PR 5 text link from someone’s blog in the same industry You’ll be able to pump up the pages you add. So if you were to go and add a page for Business Adviser Melbourne on the primary site and get a juicy, fat back link to that page, you might also get the same ranking. Because as you’ve seen, you know, even though it’s cheap and easy, now you’ve got to go and change the logo, you’ve got to move the post around, you’ve got to hyperlink the images. I can assure you, every single website you have is eating up resource, whether it’s time or money. And, you know, to put it in perspective, I’ve got a team of, let’s say a dozen, but there’s more, people working on my domain and blog network and we’ve been working on it for a year now, a year and a bit, and there’s hundreds and hundreds of sites. And that is a full-time job for a team. But I think you’ve done really well as
a start-up. The time where I would keep this in is when you already own page 1 and you’re at the top of page 1 for every phrase that the customer wants. They’ve got 600 or 700 pages on their site. They’ve got a fat blog on there. They come to you saying, “Timbo, how come we spend more money with you? How do we get more exposure? How do we increase our market shares?” You say, “Look, we’ll just go and get another domain. We re-write your entire blog with brand new content, and we go through your current blog and your analytics and see which page isn’t getting viewed the most, which pages convert into sales, because we’re attracting all of these things, and we’ll put up a very tight, targeted 50-page blog to come in and compete with you. And that’s when that strategy is uber powerful.

TIM: So do you think, just in summary—we’ll finish that conversation—is that, let’s say as a term business adviser, if they wanted to own, say, page 1 of Google for the term Business Adviser Melbourne, are they better off just working hard at having 10 links that talk about Business Adviser Melbourne on their main site, than actually crowding those external assets?

JAMES: Yeah, that’d be better to put really good premium post on their current site with that exact phrase Business Adviser Melbourne, and then they’d go and get some powerful links to that. And that page should pop up first. And I’m looking here, is it Business Adviser Melbourne you’re trying to rank for?

TIM: Yep!

JAMES: Well, there’s only one page in Google right now in .com.au, for our overseas listeners that actually targets that phrase. So, I mean, you should be able to own that phrase by tomorrow.

TIM: Yeah.

JAMES: Certainly within a week.

TIM: Beautiful. Beautiful. Well man, that’s pretty darn powerful.

JAMES: Well, I think we’ve just saved people a huge amount of time and energy.

TIM: So micro-sites strategy, good strategy but a secondary strategy until you build your primary asset.

JAMES: I think so. Just if you have finite resources. Just focus on owning it with your current website first and then when you hit the top, you say, right okay, I want more market share. And then I just want to highlight that step that I said in the middle there. Go and see what is bringing you the money now and replicate the good bits. Because with the Perido principle, the 80 20 rule, probably only 20 percent of the content on your existing site is giving you 80 percent of your profit. So just replicate that 20 percent. Now, can I give you an example how I did that in my own network?

TIM: Uh-huh.

JAMES: I bought 200 websites from somebody. I ran AdSense on them for about 6 months. And then I went back to my AdSense and then I hit the auto sort for the highest earnings. I took the top 4 and then I went and made 50 websites for each phrase. So now I had another 200 websites. So just to be clear, from my first 200 websites, I found the top 4 sites that were making the most money and then I made 50 more of each of those 4 to make another 200 websites. And that rapidly increased my income from that market because it’s like having a test and then seeing which ones won, and then replicating the winner and scaling them up. So that’s exactly what you do. You go to your service customer site, you look into
Analytics, you check the conversions on the forms. And by the way, most people are not going to have a handle in their Analytics and they’re most definitely not tracking conversions. So that is definitely step 1. Make sure you’re tracking leads so that you could measure and quantify the results and then replicate and scale the most successful parts of that website into the second site.

TIM: Brilliant, mate! And I just was reminded, when you’re talking earlier, about Squidoo lenses and all those other article marketing and all those search engine optimization strategies. Episode 10 of Freedom Ocean, we really went deep on what would constitute a really good start to a search engine optimization strategy. In fact, it was called An Introductory Search Engine Optimization Strategy Explained. So that would be a really good episode for our new listeners to go back to. Episode 10 of Freedom Ocean.

JAMES: That’s a great episode. I think it might help us because occasionally send a customer there if they had that exact same question.

TIM: Love it! Love it!

JAMES: Timbo, I’m curious about something, if you could answer for me.

TIM: Go!

JAMES: Master class, last episode, you put your heart on your sleeve and you showed the world your efforts, which has taken us a few sessions to get to that result. I just wonder how it’s panning out for you?

TIM: Mate, it’s going very well really. Since we recorded the last episode, it has only been 3 days since launch. Had some good inquiry and I’m pleased with the sales and I’m excited by September 8. I’m more looking forward to September 8 coming than anything, which is the first master class.

JAMES: So you have actually put up a sales page and you sold something?

TIM: Ah, yeah! Oh, yeah! And as soon as I got that first sale came through, I think I sent you an email that went something like, “Boom!” (laughs)

JAMES: (laughs) How did it feel?

TIM: Yeah, it’s a good feeling.

JAMES: Here’s a good exercise for you. Remember that feeling. Remember how you felt when that came through and think about that next time you’re struggling with the shopping cart or trying to put up that next product and you just can’t quite push it over the line. Just think about that feeling and lock it in.

TIM: Well, it was even better because I’m just trying to think, it came through on a Friday night at about 11 o’clock. You know? So that was exciting in itself, to be able to see a sale come through to something you worked so hard to put together at a strange time of the day. Strange time of the night. That was good!

And for listeners who are wondering what we’re talking about, I’m running an online marketing communications master class, which is an 8-week webinar series. And I’m going to be joined not only by James, but some of Australia’s leading online marketing specialists in category, in things like—whether it be YouTube, Facebook, we’re going to be talking about podcasting, search engine optimization. We’re going to be joined by some what I’d call freaks, really. Feel really honored to have sort of marketing royalty join me on the master class. Mike Rhodes, who is Google AdWords specialist. Pete Williams is going to be sharing the characteristics of a website that converts. We’ve got Steve O. Steve O’s
talking about the search engine optimization, you were talking about business principles and how your business principles have marketing, good marketing can impact on them. So we’re talking about outsourcing, pretty much covering a plethora of online marketing strategies. So it’s pretty exciting mate. And to get that first sale was wonderful.

JAMES: Very exciting for you. In fact, while we’ve been recording this I made a sale for my event.

TIM: Love it!

JAMES: And the leverage of it! The fact that you could be doing something else while your sales page is out there. I do encourage this just to go and look at your master class page because they’ll see, hopefully if it’s still up, they’ll see a video that you put together and got online, we sort of went through that in Episodes 18 and 19, was it?

TIM: Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah! I had actually created—

JAMES: Yeah. We’ve been through this step by step. You can go to Freedomocean.com/tmasterclass. That’s where you can go and see that sales page. It will take you straight to that page.

TIM: And for listeners who aren’t aware, the Freedom Ocean website, we’ve got a products page on there and you can see there’s links to both yours and my master class, James, and to a whole lot of products that could help you with your internet marketing campaign. Sort of search engine products, products that help you create your website. We’ve got previous FastWeb formula 3-day events that you’ve done, James, on DVD. There is a lot. There is a lot—

JAMES: You know what else there is, Timbo, is I noticed we got our Twitter links on there now.

TIM: We do? Yep!

JAMES: I think we’ve been ninja’d. (laughs) It went up—I didn’t notice it there yesterday. So if you want to follow Timbo or me on Twitter, there’s a link there as well at Freedomocean.com.

TIM: Alright, mate. Listen, good episode. Felt like I was at school. Feel like a naughty little boy.

JAMES: Well, maybe you didn’t get the answer you wanted but basically you’ve executed quite well. It’s the strategy that I would pay attention to.

TIM: Yep! Now that’s a fair call. Fair call.

JAMES: Now, remember what Peter Drucker said. It’s about doing the right thing. So you’ve got the doing part of I think, go and beef up the customer site with some meaty content pages, set up the conversions and I’ll love you for it.

TIM: Well, mate, James, thanks once again for sharing. And listeners, go and check out Freedomocean.com and until next time, which I am looking forward to, because I’m going to hand next episode over to you. You’ve got a little something to share that you’ve done recently on your business. So until then, mate. I believe I’ll see you out in the ocean. See you later!

JAMES: See you!


  1. James, that was so well explained, thank-you!

    Timbo, you are a true legend for putting yourself out there and allowing us to benefit. The lessons for us are HUGE…

  2. More on REAL and less on theoretical. Awesome.
    It was nailed to a REAL situation that many of us have explored.
    One of the best podcasts so far.

  3. Hi guys, old episode but still of great value and still SEO principles that are true to this day funnily enough.

    Tim, well done for taking the critic. Your responses are entertaining. 🙂



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